Posts by Band on the Run

10

did freddy practice auto writing

by jeckle in

i wonder who he was divining?

if i walked up to the average nonjw and said hi i'm anointed and i'm going to heaven and your not and got reveal biblical understanding to me and me alone or me and my select few .

wouldn't they throw a straight jacket on me straight away?

Band on the Run

Who determines valid religious belief, awash in sanctimonis respect in the US, vs. psychotic delusions? I associated with a woman suffering from schizophrenia once. Her voices told her to dunk herself in water immediately, maybe related to her seminary training. She was dragged against her will and committed. What is the different between Jesus' voices and prophetic voices, such as John in Revelation, and schizophrenia. All cultures were aware of mental illness. One exults you and the other strips you of their civil rights. Not even criminals are carted off the way the perceived mentally ill are.

For decades, the Soviet gulag was the residence for political dissidents. Western observers could not find a single element of mental illness in them, even after long deprivation and punishment. The Soviets believed they were mentally ill for dissenting. Merely dissenting meant you were will. No other explanation made sense.

I am curious how Freddie Franz garnered legitimacy. He had to be more than available. Somehow he defined doctrine. The seminary experience had to help but I don't see how it was determinative. Did he offer bribes? What type of person believes they are receiving revelations unknown since the infancy of the church? If you read Barth, Luther, Bonhoffer, Merton, C S Lewis, Hans Kung - they have faith in themselves but do not believe they are the only way God's holy spirit functions. Luther did not believe it in the beginning but evidently power went to his senses. Freddie Franz had to use a bathroom and as Dylan famously said, he had to stand naked.

46

is this site dominated by americans and canadians ?

by the max in

im new to this forum, most topics up for discussion are usa centric, and thus for us euro,s are boring, like whats on your tv chanels, wtf, who cares what your watching on tv,i dont come here to listen to that, either promote something intresting, or shut the hell up .

Band on the Run

This is an English language site. Very few English speakers live in England, a very small fraction. I am a New Yorker so I adore Euopean news. It seems to me that the basic reason people post here is Jehovah's Witnesses and country has very little to do with it. Finally, you have absolute freedom to not be bored here. Merely leave and go someplace else. I may be speaking for other people but I don't think you will be missed.

27

Awake!: For Idiots - Or Just Written By Them?

by metatron in

good grief!.

how dumb can this future landfill waste magazine get?

take a look at the march issue, "five keys to better health".

Band on the Run

One would think with computer publishing techniques they would publish three or four different levels of Awake. It is not people's fault that they are illiterate for the most part. Readers' Digest exists but so do scholarly journals and The Economist, New YOrker type of mag. What irks me the most is the Awake assumes it readers have no culture and are kindergarten reading level. It is strange to hear a lecture about resting enough and not overindulging. As far I'm aware, no other magazine does this. Maybe I just avoid them like the plague and I am definitely not a demographic.

Way back in the sixties and seventies, Awake ran such illuminating articles as use paprika to add flair and color when serving potatoes and white fish. The love that type of advice. There was also the aluminum or stainless pan thing going. My father was very engrossed in it. There were all sorts of nomedical, bogus cures circulated, too. Not even the Roman Catholic church at its height of power dictated paprika on white food. I suppose we have no parents or extended family. Universal education is not acknowledged.

I was born in and left as soon as I was physically free. My mind left many years before that date. I keep hearing about the dynamics of cult recruitment. How can anyone with a high degree from a first world country put up with this bullshit. The Watchtower problem is much more attitude, culture and audacity than doctrine. The Mormons have special underwear. There are other crazy religions. What is wrong with our culture that with so much universal education, people thirst for mind control. It is a sad commentary on Western civilization as it is damning to the Witnesses.

22

How to win a religious argument

by Terry in

one of the greatest chess players who ever lived was jose raul capablanca.. .

his was a natural talent from age 4. he became world chess champion and had an undefeated record for 9 years before high blood pressure began affecting his game.. capablanca's great technique in the end game was his greatest asset.

he only needed the smallest advantage to win by force.. consequently, the great cuban chessmaster would play simple temporizing moves provoking his opponent into over-reaching himself.. eventually, his opponent made an error.

Band on the Run

I am a lawyer. The big problem I see with Witness' discussions of the Bible and/or doctrine is that they will not engage unless you play by their rules. They are willing to walk away from anything that hints at antiWitness. Obedience is more important than reason. I've known many nice JWs but they leave their true selves behind in slavish devotion. Their faith is so weak they will not submit for even temporary examination. Former JWs are so trauamtized that we attach great importance in opening their eyes to the truth. It takes two to the play the game, though.

Suggest even a minor deviation from the Witness protocol and they will flee. Notice that deprogrammers block exits and methods of escape. Not that I am agreeing with that approach. The Witnesses always define legitimacy. usually, legitimacy is negotiated by both sides. The Bible is a weak book compared to WTBTS literature. I must confess to watching the sci fi series Merlin where magic abounds. They are under a spell or enchantment.

This is similar to TWelve Step beliefs. One focuses on one self, never promoting recovery. Rather, recovery is encouraged by attraction. When people see how well you are doing, they will want the same for themselves. Only disfellowshipping severs this bond. Since they are no in touch wtih you, they will not see how well you are doing. Taking one's inventory rather than others is a key component. I believe all the programs have no cross talk rule. Everyone's shares are valid for themselves. Comments and advice are forbidden. I found it very rude but now I see its great value.

I repeat that we cannot change them by being them and playing with their rules. Since I still believe in a God, but very different from Jehovah whom I equate with the devil, I pray that he will give them a bottom. A little bit here, a little bit there may lead up over the years to a profound change in thinking.

22

How to win a religious argument

by Terry in

one of the greatest chess players who ever lived was jose raul capablanca.. .

his was a natural talent from age 4. he became world chess champion and had an undefeated record for 9 years before high blood pressure began affecting his game.. capablanca's great technique in the end game was his greatest asset.

he only needed the smallest advantage to win by force.. consequently, the great cuban chessmaster would play simple temporizing moves provoking his opponent into over-reaching himself.. eventually, his opponent made an error.

Band on the Run

There is no way to win a religious argument. Viewpoints can be exchanged. Faith is not a factual matter. Nor is it governed by reason alone. My father, the abusing Witness, spent hours every night researching WT material to intimidate Roman Catholics at work. Wives used to call my mother, pleading for her to make him stop. Their husbands had trauam symptoms. It was never doctrine with my father. Abuse of power and intimidation were the true reasons. He only calmed down a smidgeon when he was faced with immediate dismissal for doing it. My brother in law who is Arabic Roman Catholic picks on my Anglican beliefs. My nephew attacks me politically and religiously. I know so much more in terms of culture, theology and Bible studies than they do. It is not a debate about politics. What right do I have to impose my views on them? No more right than they have to what they are doing. There is a reason politics and religion are avoided, esp. in the workplace.

My most interesting religious conversations take place with Jewish friends. We both have an interest in understanding the other's faith. I've attended Seders and they've sent me the most overtly religious Christmas cards. My starting point is that I do know something but no one can ever be perfect. I never state something is the truth. I preface it by saying I read this and mention the author. Other times I explain my private views that work for me. My present church is Anglican. The governing rule is to never judge our religion as better. Respecting others is a strong point. My confirmation teacher, an expert on the EAstern church, said God demands all our worldy gifts and more. The and more is important. I teared up as he discussed the Ten Commandments, Honor thy father. He said how some fathers were not worth any respect. Using Richard Nixon as an example, he said respect for the office, not the person was the key. He commended C.S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters to me for my terror of demons.

The intelligence, sophistication, link with historical continuity, the Catholic traditions done light, the awesome, majestic music, the stained glass windows and priceless objects, the interesting Bible studies. Respect for the laity. Indeed, in every parish I've attended, the laity is very aware that they pay the rector's salary and expect dedication and competence. Sometimes I sit and catch myself. JW abused girl is now completely comfortable. It was worth all the awkwardness and isolation.

It is one thing to say I studied it myself and I found this but many other things elude me than professing the Truth. Why leave the Witnesses to become a faux Witness?

16

Things we have WANTED rather badly in our lives....

by Terry in

jw
friends

i was at work yesterday at the bookstore.. watching a mom and her little boy.... the kid was really really wanting something or other and the mom was drawing the line and telling him "no".. he was having a come-apart over it.

some little book or movie.

to him it was a big deal.. .

Band on the Run

My own room

A backyard. We finally moved to a home when my sister was born. It was a very small yard. My bro and I figured we could keep a corral of horses, cows, pigs, geese, goats and maybe lions and tiger in a cage. It was heaven.

Paris today.

Return to living in Manhattan.

Carnaby Street clothes

Makeu p

Stocking. My mom made me wear a several sizes too small girdle. It cut my skin. I remember going to the KH with my aunt and uncle and just staring at my grown up legs through all the proceeedings. It was my best KH visit b/c I was distracted.

Peace within the family - achieved when the bastard died.

Studying French at the Sorbonne. Later, I found out that a Parisian accent is disgusting to the French. It marks low class.

Ballet lessons. no money.

Candy striper. Forced to give it up, along with scholarship, because I was too worldly for wanting to help sick people.

Beatles loot.

29

Can someone PLEASE scan the Watchtower dated 7-15-11 and PM me. Im going public. People need to be warned about this CULT. Im done sitting on the sidelines watching

by foolsparadise in

jw
friends

please send me the magazine in its entirety so it looks authentic and credible.

i will be showing this article to all media types and news authorities.

i have lost my family to this destructive cult in the past year.

Band on the Run

This same conversation seems to be an endless loop on this site. Recently, someone wanted to write a letter declaring their freedom to Bethel. One poster said the best way would be to leave cheap rosary beads on a KH doorknob. I laughed so hard b/c it is right on. A smurf doll would add to the spell.

29

Can someone PLEASE scan the Watchtower dated 7-15-11 and PM me. Im going public. People need to be warned about this CULT. Im done sitting on the sidelines watching

by foolsparadise in

jw
friends

please send me the magazine in its entirety so it looks authentic and credible.

i will be showing this article to all media types and news authorities.

i have lost my family to this destructive cult in the past year.

Band on the Run

There is an Eastern, Ivy League, liberal bias to news coverage. It once was greater. The Internet is making it less so. I care passionately about the JW b/c it was such a malevolent influence on my life for years and against my will. I was born in. No choice was exercised. Unless someone Witness KH drinks a batch of posioned kool aid on purpose, no one cares.

Besides, Americans believe in Free Exercise of religion almost absolutely. It is our largest myth. Even with Scientologists and Mormons, the stories are a curiosity. If the new executives were affected, we'd see coverage. They are highly educated and urbane. It is highly unlikely they know a sad, personal story. the Witnesses are destructive but so many much worse situations exist.

I lived in Montclair, NJ, a bedroom community of Manhattan. We had more newcasters in residence, stores were used for commercials, documentaries were filmed. It was a very affluent, college town.

/what would be helpful would be public awareness concerning controlling groups. The processes are more important than doctrine. I recall when the Moonies were in their ascendancy. Public officials called for outlawing them. An elected official said the Moonies were weird, a definite threat but mentioned that his sister was a reclusive nun who lived in a convent with no outside contact for decades. It destroyed his parents. Yet there was no bandwagon to outlaw convents and monasteries.

Aren't they infuriating with their snideness and certainty?

4

July 15th Watchtower - article on Russian court cases

by stapler99 in

jw
friends

apologies if a thread has been posted on this already but i didn't see anything.

in view of the other articles in the magazine, about apostasy and shunning, what they have to say about the treatment of jehovah's witnesses in russia takes on a new light and shows the contradiction in their positions.

some choice quotes:.

Band on the Run

Who are the judges? How many? What is their tenure? Can the decision be appealed? We all know how much respect any other strand of thought gets with them.

76

Prayers for my daughter, Ali, not a good update

by coffee_black in

jw
friends

my last update on my daughter was so good...but it didn't turn out that way.

she was cleared to go back to work, but with limitations... she couldn't lift more than 10 pounds.

her employer wanted her back but wouldn't agree to the lifting restriction.

Band on the Run

I am a diabetic and it is my very minor illness compared to some whopping ones. Jesus is present with you. I sincerely believe that whatever the outcome. I've read studies where prayer helped. Hope it does now.